DCRC ‘20 - Input needed

xj_nate

Poser
Location
UT
Hey everybody, I know this seems really far away but planning is key and Rich asked me for input!

So for those of you that have competed previously, or have always wanted to- I have a couple questions:

1) Classes. This year we had some discrepancies with classes and it seemed overly complicated to be honest. What do you think about absorbing the WERock classes?
Unlimited Pro Class
Pro Mod Pro Class
Sportsman A, B & C

and adding

Street Stock

Really that makes a class for everyone with clear requirements and should hopefully help people see that if they compete in DCRC they can also compete in the WERock series. That is the point that I really want to get across as the sport needs new competitors to keep coming in if we want it to grow. It’s also worth noting that if anybody wants another class like a JK class or the like he can make that work if there are at least a handful of competitors.

2) Anything else at all that you would change? The input here is extremely important. Maybe your idea is silly and it will get shot down but who cares, the worst thing that can happen is Big says no.


Thanks in advance!
 

skippy

Pretend Fabricator
Location
Tooele
Adopting WeRock classes simplifies everything and does away with the weird bonus points for running smaller than whatever tire is specified. Plus if someone is building a vehicle to fit a certain class they will fit in that class at every event all year long.

In short, Its a wonderful idea!
 

Johnny Quest

Web Wheeler
Location
West Jordan
i like it. it streamlines the process, and might be the push that some locals need to take the step from competing once a year at Delta to a full WeRock season. Might bring more WeRock teams to Delta as well. and less work for Rich and Shelly too.

Sportman C is pretty close to what that DCRC stock class was/is
 

xj_nate

Poser
Location
UT
might be the push that some locals need to take the step from competing once a year at Delta to a full WeRock season.
This is what I want to see. Everybody seems to think it’s too hard to do other events but it’s not. Ryan and I started on this adventure a handful of years ago and now have a truckload of trophies including 2 national championships. It’s a freakin’ riot! On top of all that it is 100000% the best way to improve your driving skills.
 

Johnny Quest

Web Wheeler
Location
West Jordan
1) is there enough of a difference between Sportsman C and whatever Street Stock would be to warrant two separate classes?
2) going solely off of the Sportsman C rulebook, I feel it is very open to interpretation, compared to the current DCRC Street Stock Class. not saying that's a bad thing....
 

Jinx

when in doubt, upgrade!
Location
So Jordan, Utah
Man, I need to read up WeRock Rules and classes before I can give serious input as to that part of the question,

but I think the one thing that Big needs to keep in mind, where Delta is more a competitors event than a spectator event and an introduction to competing for many. I would like to see in the stock class/JK class (if they run it) courses that test driving skill and strategy but don't necessarily risk trashing/rolling a rig just to compete for two days.

WeRock likes to put on a "show" for spectators to justify them spending the money to attend, but the show is usually at the expense of competitors. Luckily to be a comp driver you are committed to the game and hopefully have some sponsors to help cover repair/rebuild costs. Stock and JK guys generally aren't in that world and will likely stay away.

I have a couple of friends that are interesting in running a JK class, but I can't see them willing to trash their rigs on "extreeeemmmeeee" courses for bragging rights and gas money.

Granted I didn't compete last year so it might have been different, but the first year Big helped with DCRC the stock courses raised some cain with a bunch of the drivers in terms of breakage and body damage. Think of the black YJ from Idaho that broke everything and had to be lifted back to their camp. (Granted it is hard to tell the fine lines between "too easy", "just right", and can you roll my rig back over...)

Hope that doesn't sound like too much of downer...

The other concern that might already be answered in the rules, that I haven't read yet, is safety equipment. Stock and JK should allow OEM safety restraints with helmet, if they want new folks to try things out, keep the barriers to entry to a minimum. (no harnesses required for those classes)
 

Johnny Quest

Web Wheeler
Location
West Jordan
just my $0.02...

I spotted in stock class last year, and drove in stock class the year before. Both years, I felt the courses were set up to challenge the driver and spotter, whereas in previous years ::cough:: the courses were setup to challenge the vehicles. Other than a ujoint cap, there was no damage to the full bodied XJ that we compete with last year, and no failures with the TJ i drove the year before. i cant comment about other classes.
 

skippy

Pretend Fabricator
Location
Tooele
most body damage I ever seen in the stock class and lower classes is almost always driver/spotter error. I have competed in stock class and the JK class for the last 7 years and never once have I gotten body damage. The JK class ran on the street stock lines so if someone can get a JK through there without body damage then its definaely possible in literally any other 4wd vehicle
 

xj_nate

Poser
Location
UT
1) is there enough of a difference between Sportsman C and whatever Street Stock would be to warrant two separate classes?
2) going solely off of the Sportsman C rulebook, I feel it is very open to interpretation, compared to the current DCRC Street Stock Class. not saying that's a bad thing....
Sportsman is definitely more open to interpretation and that’s purposeful. It’s to get people involved.
Stock class will be different for sure.

Man, I need to read up WeRock Rules and classes before I can give serious input as to that part of the question,

but I think the one thing that Big needs to keep in mind, where Delta is more a competitors event than a spectator event and an introduction to competing for many. I would like to see in the stock class/JK class (if they run it) courses that test driving skill and strategy but don't necessarily risk trashing/rolling a rig just to compete for two days.

WeRock likes to put on a "show" for spectators to justify them spending the money to attend, but the show is usually at the expense of competitors. Luckily to be a comp driver you are committed to the game and hopefully have some sponsors to help cover repair/rebuild costs. Stock and JK guys generally aren't in that world and will likely stay away.

I have a couple of friends that are interesting in running a JK class, but I can't see them willing to trash their rigs on "extreeeemmmeeee" courses for bragging rights and gas money.

Granted I didn't compete last year so it might have been different, but the first year Big helped with DCRC the stock courses raised some cain with a bunch of the drivers in terms of breakage and body damage. Think of the black YJ from Idaho that broke everything and had to be lifted back to their camp. (Granted it is hard to tell the fine lines between "too easy", "just right", and can you roll my rig back over...)

Hope that doesn't sound like too much of downer...

The other concern that might already be answered in the rules, that I haven't read yet, is safety equipment. Stock and JK should allow OEM safety restraints with helmet, if they want new folks to try things out, keep the barriers to entry to a minimum. (no harnesses required for those classes)
Most of the input I’ve gotten the last two years is that the Delta courses are significantly easier than they were when Craig was in charge. I totally agree too. I used to beat my rig to death trying to get through the sadistic gates he would set up lol. We’ve discussed having a class for straight-up noobs before and I think that’s something Rich could be interested in for sure- provided we have enough people.
Also, don’t worry about sounding negative or concerned etc. as that’s the whole point of this discussion ?
 

Jinx

when in doubt, upgrade!
Location
So Jordan, Utah
Good point, I guess the course from 2018 that was most likely to raise cain with a JKU was that southern course with the "u" and the steps where Steve's 93" wb bronco was riding on his rocker panel and rubbing his armour front and rear... With out the armour he would have been rubbing sheet metal. I can't see getting a JKU on 35"s through on that part of that course...

hopefully this link will help...


By the way I think its cool that this has come up on this forum. It is a pretty good place to have a discussion. :D
 

Johnny Quest

Web Wheeler
Location
West Jordan
that southern course with the "u" and the steps
now that you bring that up, yes, that course was tight with guaranteed contact. short wheelbase rigs were able to pivot around on their drivers side rocker, but still had to get the line just right to not hit the gate. that gate was not used this year.
 

Jinx

when in doubt, upgrade!
Location
So Jordan, Utah
now that you bring that up, yes, that course was tight with guaranteed contact. short wheelbase rigs were able to pivot around on their drivers side rocker, but still had to get the line just right to not hit the gate. that gate was not used this year.
You made that line look pretty good in 2018, Ranch's old TJ did a lot better than the YJ from Idaho. :D
 

skippy

Pretend Fabricator
Location
Tooele
now that you bring that up, yes, that course was tight with guaranteed contact. short wheelbase rigs were able to pivot around on their drivers side rocker, but still had to get the line just right to not hit the gate. that gate was not used this year.
How easy could you clear that gate if you just took one of the cones???
 

Johnny Quest

Web Wheeler
Location
West Jordan
i dont think you could to be honest. You know the spot we're talking about? there was a cone on top of the hump on the drivers side, and even if you climbed high enough driver to take that cone, it put you in a bad spot tipping you hard passenger. best line was to stay level through the canyon, and try to pivot it as best you could.
 

Jinx

when in doubt, upgrade!
Location
So Jordan, Utah
i dont think you could to be honest. You know the spot we're talking about? there was a cone on top of the hump on the drivers side, and even if you climbed high enough driver to take that cone, it put you in a bad spot tipping you hard passenger. best line was to stay level through the canyon, and try to pivot it as best you could.
That is the way I remembered it as well... no good line, even with eating a cone. it was kind of a stuff it in there valley and hope you don't rub too much, but like I said we rubbed everything... The only reason the longer wheel based S-10 from Colorado made it was he wasn't worried about damage and didnt' have a bed.

Fun times. :)

What do you boys think about sponsoring/hosting a pre DCRC trip. Go down, set up some courses, play on the rocks, have some guys play judges... Do you think there would be any interest?
 

Johnny Quest

Web Wheeler
Location
West Jordan
i take that back; there was no cone on top of the rock, and we came at it from the opposite way that i remembered. I believe there were only the two cones seen here:F15D0092-C2AF-4585-A356-D184C8370C6D.jpeg
 

Jinx

when in doubt, upgrade!
Location
So Jordan, Utah
didn't we go one way on Day 1 and then reverse on Day 2?

In my head I remember one on top also... Maybe too many years of playing down there.
 
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