Is Utah loosing its appeal?

Herzog

somewhat damaged
Admin
Location
Auburn, WY
In fall of 2020, I was told that the Park City School District had an influx of 3,000 new students. I heard that went up a lot the following '21 year as well. That's A LOT for that area. Granted, a chunk of those were 2nd/3rd home residents that decided to just leave their first homes in Cali, but still.

A californian yogi looking beach girl bought the farm house next to us in the Kamas valley this Spring (super nice lady, but obviously out of place there) and so we used the same realtor to put our place up and head out after seeing how fast it sold.

Farms all over the valley are being sold and higher density housing going in. Bummer to see it happen but I get it. SLC valley is full. Heber is filling up and too expensive so next up was Kamas valley. I had some good places to escape to in the Uinta's when I first moved up but the last couple years there was no escape unless you hiked many miles in. Even the main road traffic up Mirror Lake got way too insane.

I'm sure if feels like heaven to the new folks coming in from places like Cali. Completely different perspective there, that's for sure.
 

J-mobzz

Well-Known Member
I’m guessing it’s more just the type of people I’m around. Most of the out-of-state people and meeting are coming here to ski and enjoy the outdoors and probably aren’t homeowners. I guess it makes sense that people moving from California with money from real estate are moving in the upper middle-class and higher neighborhoods.

My counterpart for the company I work for (k-12 targeted sales) in Southern California told me that San Diego is closing schools because of the loss of population of kids so they’re definitely leaving the state

The other thing I didn’t realize about California is your property taxes are based on what you pay for your house and they never change. So again my counterpart bought his house a number of years ago for $350,000 and while in today’s market it’s worth over $1 million if he was to sell it and move into another house say at 1.3 million you would now be paying property taxes on 1.3 million not $350,000. And this sucks because he wants to upgrade houses as he’s had kids since purchasing that house and needs more space but he can’t afford the property taxes on a larger house so he’s basically stuck where he’s at unless he moves out of state.
 

glockman

I hate Jeeps
Location
Pleasant Grove
My wife grew up in Socal. We had a block party last week and of the 14 houses on my street, 75% of them are people who grew up in Southern California. The Oregon BDR I just did was with two brothers who live in Springville but grew up in Ramona, CA. The other guy lives in Orem and grew up on Covina, CA. about 20% of the people I work with came from Socal the other 80% from Idaho. I must just be a California refugee magnet. My brother just built a house in Spanish fork. All 3 houses that surround him are young couples (mid 20's) who moved from California, paid cash for their house and bought 2 brand new vehicles.

My in-laws still have a house in Ontario CA. They have had to live in it the last few years because if they sell as out of state land lords, they would pay over 50% in combined taxes.
 

Houndoc

Registered User
Location
Grantsville
Just out of curiosity who has neighbors that somewhat recently moved from California? Most the people I meet that have moved from out of state in the past 10 years have not come from California. And actually thinking about it I can’t really recall knowing or meeting anyone from California.
I have a lot of clients who recent (last few years ) move ins to Utah. California seldom comes up when I ask where they moved from. Colorado is actually very common, a long with the eastern US.
My two other veterinarians both moved her shortly before starting to work for me, one from Virginia, the other Ohio,
 

J-mobzz

Well-Known Member
I have a lot of clients who recent (last few years ) move ins to Utah. California seldom comes up when I ask where they moved from. Colorado is actually very common, a long with the eastern US.
My two other veterinarians both moved her shortly before starting to work for me, one from Virginia, the other Ohio,
Yeah I get Denver a lot, and back east a lot. Idaho a ton. And for some weird reason Vegas is pretty common too.
 

Pike2350

Registered User
Location
Salt Lake City
7/10 people I talk to here are from California. Whether visiting, moved recently, or moved a long time ago.
It's funny....my sister moved off Maui after 20 years, about 5 years ago for the same reason people are complaining about Utah in this thread.

It's a problem I think every place faces. In reality CA and other liberal states have only seen a reduction in population in the last few years.

I think the bigger problem is just that asba species we are overpopulation (have and now are seeing a slow down) it is just the nature of progress and growth.
 

Skylinerider

Wandering the desert
Location
Ephraim
I love Utah and my little town, but recently the developers have noticed too. Camino Verde group(from Nevada) is buying up land and putting up shitty houses with no yards for 500k a piece and another developer put up apartments and the whole complex is already for sale for a cool 12 mil with no one living there yet. The build, profit, and then run mentality bothers me. Where I work is a 2 year college and sees a lot of new professors just starting out so they move in, get experience and then go on to bigger things at a university. We've had a lot move here from Cali with Northern Utah roots but can't get a job up there "teaching" so they come here.
 

85CUCVKRAWLER

Active Member
Location
Tooele
Frankly, i think alot of you native Utah people need a reality check. I moved here from Virginia a year and a half ago. This state is a paradise for families who are conservative and enjoy the outdoors.

My job requires me to travel all over the Mountain West, so i have hands-on experience to compare. Colorado is great, but their reality has skyrocketed even more than UT and the whole state is hostage to the insane liberals in Denver. Wyoming is great, but it is desolate, and all the things that comes with living in a desolate state; poor schools, crumbling infrastructure, rampant meth and alcoholism, no jobs, etc. Montana is great as well, but its a bipolar state that switches between Billings (a long forgotten oil refinery with some houses around it) to Bozeman (a bourgeoise utopia that no one actually lives in) with the astronomical sky high reality. Idaho is an almost even runner-up, but everything UT people complain about; IE Californians moving there and jacking up the limited housing, is 10 fold more of an issue there. There has been a bunch of articles written that CA people were scared to live in UT under Mormon rule, so they moved to ID instead, thank the lord.

What else is left? Nevada? Which isnt a bad state, but youre stuck living around LV (ugh) or Reno (dealing with the CA invasion as well). Oregon? HAH! Want your child to be taught how to have anal sex in kindergarten? Sure, go move there. Washington? While i love the Spokane valley, the state is as well a hostage to Seattle insane liberals. Spokane was legit scary to drive through recently. The homeless "problem" has turned into literal cities within the city, and everyone is forbidden to deal with issue on high command from the WA Governor. I will be there again this week and i will make sure its only a day trip. Arizona? habla espanol? yo no se? No, por favor. New Mexico? lol, you should go check it out first before considering moving there.

What about outside of the Mountain West? Well, if you need a job youll be stuck moving near a metropolis and pretty much everything east of Colorado has precisely zero public land. I dont think people here, who have never lived elsewhere, can really fathom what literally everyone else in this country endures to enjoy the outdoors. You better be rich, or know a rich person, pay out the ass for private land access, or grit your teeth when you have to camp 5 feet from your adjoining campsite's generator.

Utah has a robust economy, very low crime, excellent schools, low traffic issues (compared to other metropolis'), excellent access to public lands, climate with all four seasons, excellent infrastructure, very conservative state and local government, excellent gun rights, low police presence, and within 6 hours travel to almost all of the natural beauties our country has to offer.

What does Utah do wrong? Real estate is high, but thats literally an issue in every state right now and UT's problem is exacerbated by being near 80% public land or un-buildable. Food isnt great. Career opportunities can be limited. Inversion sucks. Sometimes really nice people knock on your door and offer to help you with things. Drivers have an issue with getting out of the left hand lane. Looks like UTV thefts are on the rise. The hunting system is confusing and very restrictive. I cant think of anything else.

I grew up in rural farm country Virginia outside Washington DC. My county consisted of working farms, commuter couples and poverty stricken enclaves of sharecropper families. In my lifetime (I am 38 years old) i lived and watched my county transform into a place i no longer recognize. It became an exclusive bourgeoise get-away for rich NGO CFO's who moonlighted on K street. I could no longer afford to live in the county i grew up in. I couldnt even afford to buy the house i grew up in as a college educated engineer with a paralegal wife. My parents bought that house new in 1994 on a single income salary. The county next to ours (Prince William) became unlivable almost overnight. It became a hot bed of illegal immigration and crime became rampant almost immediately. The county executives attempted to thwart the tidal wave that the DHS and ICE refuse to even acknowledge (ID checks, limits on numbers of people in a household, language restrictions on licensure, etc) and they were slapped down by the supreme court. Gradually, the old people left or died and the new people moved in. Now PW county has a "woman" representing them in the legislature. Isnt that amazing! How progressive! My FIL found a dead body the other day in an alley way while working in PW county. Im not even going to get into the issues with the public schools (Loudon County) or the commute (1-1/2 hours one way, if your lucky) or police issues (Let BLM shut down 234 to riot and burn, but if youre a certain skin color and your inspection sticker is dead, WATCH OUT! LIGHTS AND SIRENS, WE MUST STOP THIS CRIMINAL!!!).

I know i am rambling, but i find it astonishingly naïve some of the replies i am reading in here.
 
Last edited:

Stephen

Who Dares Wins
Supporting Member
Trip Leader
Frankly, i think alot of you native Utah people need a reality check. I moved here from Virginia a year and a half ago. This state is a paradise for families who are conservative and enjoy the outdoors.

My job requires me to travel all over the Mountain West, so i have hands-on experience to compare. Colorado is great, but their reality has skyrocketed even more than UT and the whole state is hostage to the insane liberals in Denver. Wyoming is great, but it is desolate, and all the things that comes with living in a desolate state; poor schools, crumbling infrastructure, rampant meth and alcoholism, no jobs, etc. Montana is great as well, but its a bipolar state that switches between Billings (a long forgotten oil refinery with some houses around it) to Bozeman (a bourgeoise utopia that no one actually lives in) with the astronomical sky high reality. Idaho is an almost even runner-up, but everything UT people complain about; IE Californians moving there and jacking up the limited housing, is 10 fold more of an issue there. There has been a bunch of articles written that CA people were scared to live in UT under Mormon rule, so they moved to ID instead, thank the lord.

What else is left? Nevada? Which isnt a bad state, but youre stuck living around LV (ugh) or Reno (dealing with the CA invasion as well). Oregon? HAH! Want your child to be taught how to have anal sex in kindergarten? Sure, go move there. Washington? While i love the Spokane valley, the state is as well a hostage to Seattle insane liberals. Spokane was legit scary to driver through recently. The homeless "problem" has turned into literal cities within the city, and everyone is forbidden to deal with issue on high command from the WA Governor. I will be there again this week and i will make sure its only a day trip. Arizona? habla espanol? yon no se? No, por favor. New Mexico? lol, you should go check it out first before considering moving there.

What about outside of the Mountain West? Well, if you need a job youll be stuck moving near a metropolis and pretty much everything east of Colorado has precisely zero public land. I dont think people here, who have never lived elsewhere, can really fathom what literally everyone else in this country endures to enjoy the outdoors. You better be rich, or know a rich person, pay out the ass for private land access, or grit your teeth when you have to camp 5 feet from your adjoining campsite's generator.

Utah has a robust economy, very low crime, excellent schools, low traffic issues (compared to other metropolis'), excellent access to public lands, climate with all four seasons, excellent infrastructure, very conservative state and local government, excellent gun rights, low police presence, and within 6 hours travel to almost all of the natural beauties our country has to offer.

What does Utah do wrong? Real estate is high, but thats literally an issue in every state right now and UT's problem is exacerbated by being near 80% public land or un-buildable. Food isnt great. Career opportunities can be limited. Inversion sucks. Sometimes really nice people knock on your door and offer to help you with things. Drivers have an issue with getting out of the left hand lane. Looks like UTV thefts are on the rise. I cant think of anything else.

I grew up in rural farm country Virginia outside Washington DC. My county consisted of working farms, commuter couples and poverty stricken enclaves of sharecropper families. In my lifetime (I am 38 years old) i lived and watched my county transform into a place i no longer recognize. It became an exclusive bourgeoise get-away for rich NGO CFO's who moonlighted on K street. I could no longer afford to live in the county i grew up in. I couldnt even afford to buy the house i grew up in as a college educated engineer with a paralegal wife. My parents bought that house new in 1994 on a single income salary. The county next to ours (Prince William) became unlivable almost overnight. It became a hot bed of illegal immigration and crime became rampant almost immediately. The county executives attempted to thwart the tidal wave that the DHS and ICE refuse to even acknowledge (ID checks, limits on numbers of people in a household, language restrictions on licensure, etc) and they were slapped down by the supreme court. Gradually, the old people left or died and the new people moved in. Now PW county has a "woman" representing them in the legislature. Isnt that amazing! How progressive! My FIL found a dead body the other day in an alley way while working in PW county. Im not even going to get into the issues with the public schools (Loudon County) or the commute (1-1/2 hours one way, if your lucky) or police issues (Let BLM shut down 234 to riot and burn, but if youre a certain skin color and your inspection sticker is dead, WATCH OUT! LIGHTS AND SIRENS, WE MUST STOP THIS CRIMINAL!!!).

I know i am rambling, but i find it astonishingly naïve some of the replies i am reading in here.
Not really naive, I get what you're saying. But what you are describing happening to your home in VA is what we native Utahn's are seeing happening here. I can't afford to live in the area I grew up in, the more people that come in, the more crowded the public lands are becoming, which in turn is leading to greater restrictions on land and having to camp five feet from neighbors generator, etc, etc.
What I'm saying is its all perspective. The Utah from 5-10 years ago is a different planet from the one we live in now. Much like your home county in VA is unrecognizable to you now.
 

Herzog

somewhat damaged
Admin
Location
Auburn, WY
Frankly, i think alot of you native Utah people need a reality check. I moved here from Virginia a year and a half ago. This state is a paradise for families who are conservative and enjoy the outdoors.

My job requires me to travel all over the Mountain West, so i have hands-on experience to compare. Colorado is great, but their reality has skyrocketed even more than UT and the whole state is hostage to the insane liberals in Denver. Wyoming is great, but it is desolate, and all the things that comes with living in a desolate state; poor schools, crumbling infrastructure, rampant meth and alcoholism, no jobs, etc. Montana is great as well, but its a bipolar state that switches between Billings (a long forgotten oil refinery with some houses around it) to Bozeman (a bourgeoise utopia that no one actually lives in) with the astronomical sky high reality. Idaho is an almost even runner-up, but everything UT people complain about; IE Californians moving there and jacking up the limited housing, is 10 fold more of an issue there. There has been a bunch of articles written that CA people were scared to live in UT under Mormon rule, so they moved to ID instead, thank the lord.

What else is left? Nevada? Which isnt a bad state, but youre stuck living around LV (ugh) or Reno (dealing with the CA invasion as well). Oregon? HAH! Want your child to be taught how to have anal sex in kindergarten? Sure, go move there. Washington? While i love the Spokane valley, the state is as well a hostage to Seattle insane liberals. Spokane was legit scary to driver through recently. The homeless "problem" has turned into literal cities within the city, and everyone is forbidden to deal with issue on high command from the WA Governor. I will be there again this week and i will make sure its only a day trip. Arizona? habla espanol? yon no se? No, por favor. New Mexico? lol, you should go check it out first before considering moving there.

What about outside of the Mountain West? Well, if you need a job youll be stuck moving near a metropolis and pretty much everything east of Colorado has precisely zero public land. I dont think people here, who have never lived elsewhere, can really fathom what literally everyone else in this country endures to enjoy the outdoors. You better be rich, or know a rich person, pay out the ass for private land access, or grit your teeth when you have to camp 5 feet from your adjoining campsite's generator.

Utah has a robust economy, very low crime, excellent schools, low traffic issues (compared to other metropolis'), excellent access to public lands, climate with all four seasons, excellent infrastructure, very conservative state and local government, excellent gun rights, low police presence, and within 6 hours travel to almost all of the natural beauties our country has to offer.

What does Utah do wrong? Real estate is high, but thats literally an issue in every state right now and UT's problem is exacerbated by being near 80% public land or un-buildable. Food isnt great. Career opportunities can be limited. Inversion sucks. Sometimes really nice people knock on your door and offer to help you with things. Drivers have an issue with getting out of the left hand lane. Looks like UTV thefts are on the rise. I cant think of anything else.

I grew up in rural farm country Virginia outside Washington DC. My county consisted of working farms, commuter couples and poverty stricken enclaves of sharecropper families. In my lifetime (I am 38 years old) i lived and watched my county transform into a place i no longer recognize. It became an exclusive bourgeoise get-away for rich NGO CFO's who moonlighted on K street. I could no longer afford to live in the county i grew up in. I couldnt even afford to buy the house i grew up in as a college educated engineer with a paralegal wife. My parents bought that house new in 1994 on a single income salary. The county next to ours (Prince William) became unlivable almost overnight. It became a hot bed of illegal immigration and crime became rampant almost immediately. The county executives attempted to thwart the tidal wave that the DHS and ICE refuse to even acknowledge (ID checks, limits on numbers of people in a household, language restrictions on licensure, etc) and they were slapped down by the supreme court. Gradually, the old people left or died and the new people moved in. Now PW county has a "woman" representing them in the legislature. Isnt that amazing! How progressive! My FIL found a dead body the other day in an alley way while working in PW county. Im not even going to get into the issues with the public schools (Loudon County) or the commute (1-1/2 hours one way, if your lucky) or police issues (Let BLM shut down 234 to riot and burn, but if youre a certain skin color and your inspection sticker is dead, WATCH OUT! LIGHTS AND SIRENS, WE MUST STOP THIS CRIMINAL!!!).

I know i am rambling, but i find it astonishingly naïve some of the replies i am reading in here.
I don't disagree with anything you've said, but at the same time it is all about perspective. We are not happy with the way our home state has changed. Is it still better than most of the others? Yes, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't strive for it to be even better than it already is, and letting off steam about it is part of that process. :beer:
 

85CUCVKRAWLER

Active Member
Location
Tooele
I don't disagree with anything you've said, but at the same time it is all about perspective. We are not happy with the way our home state has changed. Is it still better than most of the others? Yes, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't strive for it to be even better than it already is, and letting off steam about it is part of that process. :beer:

Sure, which i understand. But these gripes could be levied against pretty much every state. Especially the housing complaints. Which are not so much a UT issue, as an issue of a totally corrupt society (and now ill really make people mad) where the boomers have basically robbed our country blind, kept us in perpetual war, ushered in a slave labor class of illegal immigrants to cut their lawns, and left the following generations crumbles and scraps while muttering "why dont millennials work harder?" as their fat asses waddle off into their golden parachute retirement.
 

jeeper

Currently without Jeep
Location
So Jo, Ut
Sure, which i understand. But these gripes could be levied against pretty much every state. Especially the housing complaints. Which are not so much a UT issue, as an issue of a totally corrupt society (and now ill really make people mad) where the boomers have basically robbed our country blind, kept us in perpetual war, ushered in a slave labor class of illegal immigrants to cut their lawns, and left the following generations crumbles and scraps while muttering "why dont millennials work harder?" as their fat asses waddle off into their golden parachute retirement.

Millennial here checking in. My younger brother likes to blame the boomers for his problems also.

Truth is though, anyone can succeed if they push for it. I work 60-100 hrs a week. I have been very conservative in my spending (Bought a tv for the FIRST time in 2020, and even paid for about 5 months of streaming service). I am looking forward to my fat butt waddling off into my retirement also... and a great retirement it should be.
 

mesha

By endurance we conquer
Supporting Vendor
Location
A.F.
Millennial here checking in. My younger brother likes to blame the boomers for his problems also.

Truth is though, anyone can succeed if they push for it. I work 60-100 hrs a week. I have been very conservative in my spending (Bought a tv for the FIRST time in 2020, and even paid for about 5 months of streaming service). I am looking forward to my fat butt waddling off into my retirement also... and a great retirement it should be.

There are more hours in a week than that so you could do better. Lazy millennial.
 

Houndoc

Registered User
Location
Grantsville
As has been said before, it is all about change.

Humans seem to be programed to want things to remain stable- this can be growth to our cities, changes in culture (note negative comments in several posts about immigration, language etc), or whatever. Except we pick and choose, some of the same people I know who complain about immigration and people who 'don't speak our language' enjoy the greater variety of food options these same people bring.

Even with nature, we seem determined to keep things stable. Since deer is my main hunt, I will use that as an example. Many of us either remember or have been told about the hay day of mule deer hunting from the 50s to 70s. Deer numbers have dropped significantly since and there is a strong drive to reverse that decline- never mind the fact that prior historically deer where not the main big mammal, with elk and bighorn sheep being more common than they are now.

Just a few examples, but real point is we all seem programmed to dislike change.
 
Top