So now what

4x4_Welder

Well-Known Member
Location
Twin Falls, ID
I haven't seen any discussion of this on here, so while I try and steer clear of political crap, I think this needs to be talked about:

What the hell is Trump doing? Inciting riots, his supporters storming the capitol building? Refusing to gracefully step aside and let the political process happen is just insane. This has done so much to damage any respectability the republican party has left, he might as well have handed the next ten years to solid democrat control.
 

Spork

Tin Foil Hat Equipped
Are we really going to get into Trump's the bad guy here? It's not like 5 states all announced they were stopping counting in the middle of the night with Trump in the lead and somehow had an additional 100k votes for Biden when counting restarted, it's not like we had dead people voting, no signatures validated, votes quite simply switched from Trump to Biden but forget all that Orange Man bad. The Republican party is dead, they don't have the balls to stand up and say there's a problem here, they roll over and ask for more abuse. There's no point of voting any more. Please show me where Trump said go break into Pelosi's office and ransack the place. Hell there's been rioting all summer long, you remember all that peaceful burning/looting/autonomous zone or don't you because the media just glossed over all of it while the cities burned?

Go ahead tell me Biden is the most popular president ever with 80 million votes, more popular than Obama, more popular than Hillary, while he sits in his basement and can't seem to get more than 20 people stuck in cute little circles to his public events. If you believe the Orange man is bad here go stick your head in the sand listen to the media ask Biden the tough questions like what he had for breakfast.
 

Spork

Tin Foil Hat Equipped
Go jump on the peaceful democrat bandwagon... I'm glad they were in DC instead of burning or looting some poor small business owner's place.

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Pike2350

Registered User
Location
Salt Lake City
Are we really going to get into Trump's the bad guy here? It's not like 5 states all announced they were stopping counting in the middle of the night with Trump in the lead and somehow had an additional 100k votes for Biden when counting restarted, it's not like we had dead people voting, no signatures validated, votes quite simply switched from Trump to Biden but forget all that Orange Man bad. The Republican party is dead, they don't have the balls to stand up and say there's a problem here, they roll over and ask for more abuse. There's no point of voting any more. Please show me where Trump said go break into Pelosi's office and ransack the place. Hell there's been rioting all summer long, you remember all that peaceful burning/looting/autonomous zone or don't you because the media just glossed over all of it while the cities burned?

Go ahead tell me Biden is the most popular president ever with 80 million votes, more popular than Obama, more popular than Hillary, while he sits in his basement and can't seem to get more than 20 people stuck in cute little circles to his public events. If you believe the Orange man is bad here go stick your head in the sand listen to the media ask Biden the tough questions like what he had for breakfast.
I dont want to get into all this unproven accusations since I am sick of hearing both sides of the argument....but I will believe the numerous courts ignoring the cases..the. numerous times Trump was shut down in his attempt to prove anything. I will believe that many of those that shut him down were R's. I have not seen any real proof of anything that would really sway the election a different direction. The evidence is just not there that it was a huge fraud. If there was the huge Democrat fraud why didn't they do better in other races? There was a huge prediction of a "Blue wave" why didnt it materialize IF the Dems really were able to commit such blatant fraud? It's just not there to the level Trump wants to say.

Was there fraud...you bet, there is every election on both sides.

As for.Biden getting 80million votes...no he is certainly not the most popular...however that is a shirt sighted way to look at it. He wasnt more popular...Trump just turned off WAY more people. This was a HUGE election in terms of voter turnout....and I firmly believe the largest increase was strictly voters JUST voting against Trump. Just like in 2016....most of Trumps votes were mostly a vote against Hitlary.

My mom and dad...die hard Republicans...vote party line for 50+ years voted for Biden because they were completely disgusted with Trump, his ego, and his lack or moral character(my mom'w own words)
 

4x4_Welder

Well-Known Member
Location
Twin Falls, ID
I'm not saying there wasn't wrongdoing, fraud, etc, but doing things this way isn't going to help anyone. Maybe it is the slant of the media doing their own narrative, but he's playing right into it.
 

johngottfredson

Threat Level Midnight
Location
Alpine
Love it! Those who think Trump's protesters are justified because the left was cool with protesting. Let's just forget that when the left protested Trump folks were all high and mighty, like they were above it and the left were brainless scum with no principles.

Plenty of us are comfortable with the position that ANYONE who becomes mindless rioting drones are not to be tolerated, justified, or defended, and those who are most responsible for inspiring, aiding, and abetting their despicable behavior should be held fully accountable. Trump is governed by his ego, he would let the foundations of the country burn to the ground if it meant he could get his head on mount rushmore. Nobody with any grasp of reality was surprised that Trump was going to say the election was stolen. That move was foreordained. Perhaps more sad but also not surprising is the support of his delusions by those who let their imagined grievances overpower any semblance of principle, beyond trying to stick it to liberals.

I am no longer confused by how Nazis came into power. People are freaking retarded.
 

Cody

Random Quote Generator
Supporting Member
Location
East Stabbington
I don't blame Trump, he's just a symptom. I feel like in the previous 10+ years, the media has fanned the coals of us v them. People are so quick now to draw a line in the sand and point fingers, place blame. Too much intolerance. Trump fed that divide, which was probably both his greatest asset and greatest mistake. It just caused too much distrust amongst people.

I'll say this, but I'm not picking a fight or pointing in anyone's direction in particular. I know many of us are just simply not going to agree on this. There was fraud in the election. I would say there is fraud in every election. Any time you do something that involves hundreds of millions of people, tens of thousands of workers, and so many moving parts and systems over a short time with massive consequences, something is going to be missed or screwed up somewhere. That being said, my personal opinion from my personal perspective, is that the majority of the cheating was on the Trump side of things and I also think that is why Trump supporters are so angry (well, many are angry because they have been told they should be angry, but the people telling those people to be angry are angry because...)...how do you still lose an election, when you worked so hard to game the system? In some states where Trump was a head, pressuring to "stop the count!". In states where behind "Count the votes!". Closing poling stations. Intimidation tactics at poling sites reported, not just in Lehi, but all over. Cutting funding from the USPS to prevent mail in ballots from making it in time, and then trying to not count them. Do you think that if Trump thought that the majority of mail-in ballots were going to be for him, that he would have done that? Answer honestly. Then the lawsuits, and the pandering to his followers. But wait! It was the Italians! Trump didn't lose, the Italian Defense Contractor under direction from the Roman Embassy used a military grade satellite to move votes from one state to another! Duh, It's so obvious! Why else could there be such drastic spikes in vote numbers as different poling locations report? It couldn't be because of higher populous areas that were ALWAYS assumed to be voting blue were being reported (is it surprising that in Utah, the big jumps in Biden votes also happened, probably because of the Italians, but also possibly when SLC stations reported?) Nevermind that the proof could have been written by someone on Reddit with a 6 grade education, and that beyond the irrefutable affidavit smoking gun (and the conveniently "in hiding" informant), and that they can't show the drastic reduction in votes from the states that the votes were allegedly moved from. The Italians! When the Italian Job blows over, it'll be something else. I bet even some of the most loyal Trump people look at that story as crazy, and then wonder why the rest of their arguments, which may or may not have any validity, are treated like science fiction. But, then again, the Italian Job was probably pushed by Antifa to delegitimize the other election fraud arguments.

The frustrating thing, is that no matter what happens, another spin will happen to explain why the last thing never was explained. It's a conspiracy after all, and it's far more likely that the rabbit hole gets deeper than the alternative, more simple and logical explanation could be true. It's like Flat-earthers shooting the laser beam across the water and getting the exact results you would expect if the world was round. Obviously the test is flawed! There is no other explanation! It's the ultimate argument to take too, since you don't have the burden of proof, you don't have to be proven right, and you can't be proven wrong because you can spin something else out of it. The Italians. If bits and pieces of it turn out to be true, as I'm sure bits and pieces of it are, then you can point and say I told you so. But when it blows over, it's because of a massive international conspiracy and that's just how these things work.

But, the public is notoriously and historically fickle. Many Trump supporters will go back to being Republicans. Many who voted for Biden because they simply couldn't buy what Trump was selling will go back to being Republicans. I don't think the political division will change as it's always been Red v Blue in all of my lifetime (which is the problem, again IMO). I just hope that people on both sides will start to see that they have more in common as Americans than not, and respect each other's differences, and celebrate our diversity.

I also hope for nothing more than for the Italian Job to be true. I love a good dumpster fire and I want to see that shit happen. But I'm too much of a skeptic.

But, if it does come true, just to eat my words I will cook everyone dinner wearing the full on Trump MAGA lifestyle brand kit. Shit I'll dress up as that Chewbaka MAGA guy (which is obviously Antifa, duh. Possibly Italian too (unverified)) and bring all the plates out. I'll even open carry so everyone feels safe. I promise.
 
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jeeper

Currently without Jeep
Location
So Jo, Ut
I just wish we could trust the media and others to tell the truth. EVERY article and headline gets spun in favor of their opinion. It's so obvious the hate they have for trump and the love they had for Obama, and now Biden. The tone of the media has caused more of a divide than any president could every do.
 

Cody

Random Quote Generator
Supporting Member
Location
East Stabbington
I just wish we could trust the media and others to tell the truth. EVERY article and headline gets spun in favor of their opinion. It's so obvious the hate they have for trump and the love they had for Obama, and now Biden. The tone of the media has caused more of a divide than any president could every do.
For sure, the media is absolutely the catalyst for most of this stuff. But it really depends on your source. There are plenty of conservative sources that are just as blindly skewed to the other side. Facebook reported yesterday that 63% of people that are members of the "extremist" political groups on FB, found the group through a Facebook recommendation. "They" know what you want. They are tracking you, watching what you are looking at, what you are consuming, listening to what you talk about, and then tailoring their message to you. It's no wonder we all find ourselves in our own little echo chambers. Information is curated for us automatically, and is designed to get a response.
 

Kevin B.

Big hippy
Location
Stinkwater
They are tracking you, watching what you are looking at, what you are consuming, listening to what you talk about, and then tailoring their message to you.

That's as much our fault as it is theirs. Every one of us is guilty to some extent of seeking out news sources that validate our biases.

But yeah, the media as a group has decided it's not their job to report objective news, it's their job instead to tell us what to think about the news. When they're not just being sensational to generate ad revenue that is. And that's a problem for sure.
 

Stephen

Who Dares Wins
Supporting Member
Trip Leader
I just wish we could trust the media and others to tell the truth. EVERY article and headline gets spun in favor of their opinion. It's so obvious the hate they have for trump and the love they had for Obama, and now Biden. The tone of the media has caused more of a divide than any president could every do.
Yes, the major media outlets skew left; have for decades. You think what is happening to Trump is some unique level of viciousness? Read up on the Nixon years, my friend. As Cody mentioned in our modern era of social media, "they" know what you are looking at on the information super highway. So if you've made a conscious decision to avoid CNN and only get your news from Info Wars and other QAnon approved outlets, yeah, your going to be spoon fed information that confirms that narrative. At a certain point you've got to take personal responsibility though and start thinking critically for yourself. Every person with a [D] next to their name or media credentials is not an "enemy of the state" and out to destroy liberty and freedom. Do they at times have a different view on what America should look like, sure. But I'd bet if you were to sit down over a pint of beer, you'd have more common ground than you'd think.
 

Pike2350

Registered User
Location
Salt Lake City
Yes, the major media outlets skew left; have for decades. You think what is happening to Trump is some unique level of viciousness? Read up on the Nixon years, my friend. As Cody mentioned in our modern era of social media, "they" know what you are looking at on the information super highway. So if you've made a conscious decision to avoid CNN and only get your news from Info Wars and other QAnon approved outlets, yeah, your going to be spoon fed information that confirms that narrative. At a certain point you've got to take personal responsibility though and start thinking critically for yourself. Every person with a [D] next to their name or media credentials is not an "enemy of the state" and out to destroy liberty and freedom. Do they at times have a different view on what America should look like, sure. But I'd bet if you were to sit down over a pint of beer, you'd have more common ground than you'd think.
Funny you say this. I have considered myself a Libertarian since college 20 years ago. I've "thrown away my vote" in almost every election.

I do feel I am objective and take most news stories with a grain of salt. I look at what the media outlet is and adjust my belief of the story accordingly. I try not to watch major outlets, but also stay off social media (aside from forums) I love watching Bill Mahr (although I rarely agree with him) I generally like Tucker Carlson (again, I don't agree with him a lot) I can listen to what they say and know it is biased and adjust how I take it from there.

I find most of my friends & family are more liberal then I am...and that's ok. We can still talk. I am one of the few that can discuss politics without getting heated. I feel I always try to look at things with an open, objective mind as much as possible. I try an evaluate why someone would be claiming what they are, or doing what they are doing.

In this case, the past 4 years (more like the past 10) Trump has proven to be very arrogant and I can completely see why he'd believe the election was stolen....he can't believe he could lose. He has always blamed everyone else for things that have gone wrong. He praises people one minute but turns on them in a second and starts calling them names when they don't follow his will. He's proven that he is a sore loser and will always be this way. Those characteristics are not ones of a leader. He may have done a few good things in office (every president does, no matter how badly you disagree with their overall presidency) I just felt that Trump was way more of a liability to this country then an asset and so I held me nose and voted for the "lesser of 2 evils" this last election....AS I SAW IT.

To the point of realizing that not every person on the opposite side of the isle is some how out to destroy this country (no matter what side you are currently on) Just by voting for Biden, I've been called a socialist, communist, liberal and all kinds of other names on other boards, yet in turn, I don't look at people that voted for Trump as QAnon, racists, rednecks or any other way just because they voted for Trump. I will look at a few factors and THEN call them that :cody: 🤪X-D

Seriously though, as a nation, we need to start looking to middle of the isle as the meeting place and stop being pulled further and further to the outside isles where you can't reach the middle anymore.

I honestly hope the next 4 years, the Dems will be a little more scared at what occurred and will be more willing to reach toward the middle...but only time will tell.
 
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