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TRUMP: Whats the real deal?

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jeeper

Currently without Jeep
Location
So Jo, Ut
I've been wanting to post something like this for a long while, but really don't like getting into politics, and especially not on the internet..

But I have some genuine questions, and want to get input from some of you smart people..
I am not looking for opinions on the guy, and don't want to start bashing one way or the other..

From what I have seen, Trump has made a lot of changes in our laws. It's seems to me that he has really made America better.
For Example:
-(from today) Water issues that ranchers have been having with the Federal government have been relaxed in the ranchers favor.
-Everyone that I have talked to benefits from the tax cuts he implemented. Many people I know received a $1,000 bonus because of it, plus have lower taxes.
-Land issues have been to our favor, like Bears Ears, (this is a negative for others though, and maybe should not be included)
-Some companies who were planning to move out of the country have stayed specifically because of laws changing in their favor.
-The tariff war that he started has resulted in a surrender by China, and is resulting in a more fair trade agreement.
-Energy extraction has been able to increase, resulting in local jobs and better fuel prices.

When it comes time to vote, the question I will ask of myself is if my life is better or worse from the past years. Currently It is better.

My honest question is if there are laws and such that have been implemented by Trump that have made the economy in America worse? Is anyone personally in a worse place than they were 2 years ago because of changes he made?
 

Herzog

somewhat damaged
Admin
Location
Kamas, UT
If you watch the media, he’s the worst thing that’s ever happened.

If you think for yourself, the dude is a genius and he’s doing a shit ton that needed to be done. More coming too.

I’m not a fan of govt by any means (probably because of the bush/obama years) but I’m definitely on the Trump / Q train. I voted Libertarian party in 2016. I’ll be voting Trump 2020.
 

spaggyroe

Man Flu Survivor
Location
Lehi
If you watch the media, he’s the worst thing that’s ever happened.

If you think for yourself, the dude is a genius and he’s doing a shit ton that needed to be done. More coming too.

I’m not a fan of govt by any means (probably because of the bush/obama years) but I’m definitely on the Trump / Q train. I voted Libertarian party in 2016. I’ll be voting Trump 2020.

Were we separated at birth..???
 

Pike2350

Registered User
Location
Salt Lake City
Personally i don't credit any single president with the economy... at least not until they've been in office for more than a term. Way too many things take a long time to work through the econony and be felt by the average Joe. Conversely, in 2 more years we all may feel much worse off since it takes so long for things to be worked through.

I hear from the right how great he's doing and from the left how evil he is. I don't believe either side because they only look at the points they want.
Noone knows exactly how new policies will look in a few years....just look at how some of Clintons policies didn't have the negative affect until 10 years later. I don't know how Trumps policies will look in a few years even though a few may seem good now. Is that whole short term/ long term thing.

Personally I will not vote for Trump in 2020. I think more dirt will come ot in him in the next 2 years. I will vote Libertarian again. I want a change from the 2 party system.
 

Bart

Registered User
Supporting Member
Location
Arm Utah
Again, I know I'm the minority here, but my family saw no extra money and from what I hear, Utah had to raise their tax this year to compensate for Trump policies. I'm waiting until after tax time to see what actually happened with our income. I know that everything he has done has put millions into his companies and his own pocket. Personally, I can't get past all the lies.
 

UNSTUCK

But stuck more often.
Location
Magna
I'm a pretty hard core third party voter by principal, although my beliefs tend to lean republican. With today's news about the "fight" in the oval office it will be interesting to see what happens. He promised us Mexico would pay for the wall. That BETTER happen. I firmly believe the wall is not the answer and in the end will be a waste of our money, because we all know Mexico will not foot the bill.

I will be very interested to see if the republican party would try to get other republicans to run against him. Probably won't happen.
 

Cody

Random Quote Generator
Supporting Member
Location
East Stabbington
I know from a small business tax perspective, Trump's policies have been more beneficial for me/us. Obama's policies sounded amazing on paper, but in effect basically froze SBA lending which is one of the reason's job growth in the economy was so stagnant. On a selfish level, my particular business does better when unemployment is high, so the good economy benefits most people more directly than me.

I think he's a turd, just like I thought he was a turd when he was on a reality tv show, but that doesn't mean he can't have a positive impact. I think the Q stuff is interesting, but that group and it's promises of exposing one massive government conspiracy after another is getting to be as much of a broken record as what main stream media is feeding us. Until they actually put their money behind their mouth, it's just tin-hats counter programming the mainstream media.
 

larrybenny

larrybenny
I have a hard time believing that a constant liar is capable of doing what is right for our country. Trump even lied on the live discussion about the wall yesterday, saying that 10 terrorists had been caught trying to cross with the caravan. No one has documented that. Simply cannot believe anything he says. Trump is not fit to be the leader of the free world, or our country. And no, I won't be benefiting from the tax cuts for the rich, nor the trickle down effect from corporate tax cuts.
 

Jesser04

Well-Known Member
Location
Kaysville Utah
I hear a lot of “the wall isn’t the answer” or “the wall won’t work” talk and it drives me crazy. In any line of work if you’re presented with a problem that needs to be addressed and someone comes up with an idea that you don’t like you can just say it’s a bad idea you need a better idea.
 

Cody

Random Quote Generator
Supporting Member
Location
East Stabbington
I think the wall is stupid, for the record. I think the solution is a more realistic process for allowing immigrants to come here to better their lives. If you go through the process, you can come here. Create a work program where immigrants work on government projects, roads, etc for 2 years for a fair wage and access to education and benefits. After the 2 years, they take a citizenship exam and if they pass, they have citizenship. If they are busted for any felony, they give up their citizenship and get shipped back. The way it is now, the majority of the people that come across the border are doing so against the law, and I would rather encourage law abiding people to come than those willing to scoff at the law.
 

Homefryy

Premium Member
Supporting Member
Location
Salt Lake City
I hear a lot of “the wall isn’t the answer” or “the wall won’t work” talk and it drives me crazy. In any line of work if you’re presented with a problem that needs to be addressed and someone comes up with an idea that you don’t like you can just say it’s a bad idea you need a better idea.
I have a better idea and the fact that it is never discussed tells me that nobody in politics is actually interested in reducing illegal immigration. Too many of them profit directly or have donors that profit from the cheap labor provided by illegal immigrants.

Here is the answer... Offer a cash reward for each illegal immigrant that is being employed to whoever reports the employer to the necessary authorities. The reward would come out of fines against the employer so it wouldn't cost the government anything. Non-illegals would be all over that if they could make some extra cash and it would cut the problem off at the source. People wouldn't come here if they were guaranteed not to find a job. The problem with this is a lot of wealthy people make a lot of money employing them and don't want this to happen.

A wall may slow people down but it won't stop them. There are already tunnels dug under the boarder. People will find a way.
 

Jesser04

Well-Known Member
Location
Kaysville Utah
I think the wall is stupid, for the record. I think the solution is a more realistic process for allowing immigrants to come here to better their lives. If you go through the process, you can come here. Create a work program where immigrants work on government projects, roads, etc for 2 years for a fair wage and access to education and benefits. After the 2 years, they take a citizenship exam and if they pass, they have citizenship. If they are busted for any felony, they give up their citizenship and get shipped back. The way it is now, the majority of the people that come across the border are doing so against the law, and I would rather encourage law abiding people to come than those willing to scoff at the law.
I can get with this I’d change it to anything other than traffic violations but I like it. The problem is I don’t think they’ll sign up for it. They pay little to no taxes and I don’t think they’ll have much interest it starting to pay them. For example joe the Mexican is working for 10 bucks an hour claiming married and 6 but he is really single and 0. Working a 40 hour week his check is gonna go from 375 down to 300.Joe ain’t gonna be cool with that.
 

Stephen

Under Construction
Supporting Member
Location
Salt Lake City
I think the wall is stupid, for the record. I think the solution is a more realistic process for allowing immigrants to come here to better their lives. If you go through the process, you can come here. Create a work program where immigrants work on government projects, roads, etc for 2 years for a fair wage and access to education and benefits. After the 2 years, they take a citizenship exam and if they pass, they have citizenship. If they are busted for any felony, they give up their citizenship and get shipped back. The way it is now, the majority of the people that come across the border are doing so against the law, and I would rather encourage law abiding people to come than those willing to scoff at the law.
Ding, ding! You don't fire up your xenophobic base if you say you want to help "others", though. That makes you a bleeding heart liberal!
99% of these people are trying to better their lives and the lives of their families. If you were in their situation, you'd probably want that too. And the reality is, they want to be here and they want to work. Are they stealing jobs? Not really. And the solution to that argument has nothing to do with the immigrants themselves, but rather the people employing them. As has been said before, if the employers where held accountable and forced to pay an actual wage, then "American's" would be willing to work these jobs again. But when you can get away with paying an illegal immigrant a fraction of what the work should "actually" cost, why wouldn't you?

A wall is pointless. What needs to happen is a comprehensive rewrite of our immigration laws and better enforcement of those laws.
 
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