Whole house backup generator

[Mouse]

Has anyone done a whole-house backup generator? Got a quote today on an install; it's bit higher than I anticipated, but had an upgraded gas meter and went to a 24KW Generac for the quote.

Any recommendations on installer or anything else?

 

[haulinshine]

I would take a look at your monthly bill for electricity, a 24kw generator is most likely overkill for your home, you will likely only need 5-10kw unless you have very high usage. I had a 10kw hooked up to my house for a little while due to an issue with a contractor for the neighbors and it never even moved up to high with the power demand for my house in July, running an old and not at all efficient ac unit. Is it going to have a concrete pad poured for it? if you have time you could pretty easily install one unless you are having it put a fair distance from the house and running the cabling underground then having someone install would be much easier.

 

[Corban_White]

24 KW!!!! That's serious! I don't know your house but I bet you could do pretty well with a backup generator half that size.

 

[Mouse]

I thought the KW was a bit high, but we ran the electrical load through the Generac estimator. The elevation and using natural gas drives the output lower than the unit's 24KW rating. The estimator recommends the 24KW based on those factors (Fridge, freezer, 4 ton AC are the biggest loads).

The estimate included a pad from Generac. It's a pre-cast piece at $350. I've not done concrete, so I have to ask for help or just roll it into the install process. I also had them up the gas regulator to a bigger unit. Technically our existing is big enough, but we are planning to build a shop soon, and I want to be able to run a gas heater in it, so since they have to be working on the gas system, it made sense to upgrade that now.

The generator will be along our house's eastern wall (with the minimum stand-off distances). We are fortunate to have gas and electrical service at that corner of the house.

 

[haulinshine]

a 4 ton compressor only pulls around 4kw per hour of operation, and between your fridge and freezer you are looking around .35kw per hour. A 10 or 16 would do you just fine. Getting a pad poured and the whole thing installed I think the best deal you could probably find would be in the $6k range. With generac once you hit 13kw as long as you have the flow rate for NG your KW is the same as LP until you get to the 24kw range. The only thing you could run into is if you are running literally all of the appliances in your house while the AC is running and you have every light on then you might get over 16kw of load. the 16kw is around $1k cheaper than the 24kw so if you want to save some money that is the route I would go. It will also be a lot cheaper to operate when the power does go out as the flow is around 20% less on the 16kw.

One thing I always think about when someone is quoting installs to me is that the guy selling it get a commission based on the value of what they sell and will always try to upsell you.

 

[Mouse]

The estimate is well north of $6K

 

[Kirk]

I have a poor mans version of generator backup - I have a 220v plug wired in my garage, about 40 feet of extension cord with ends. and a 4,000w onan generator. When the power goes out, I have to go out an turn off the main disconnect to my house, roll the generator out to the side of my house, start the generator, and plug it in. It will pretty much run everything but the central air (I assume the oven might not work but I haven't tried it) I have it for emergencies and figure I can do without my central air during a power outage. My system doesn't have a switch - so I have to watch my neighbors lights and when I see the power is back on, I unplug my generator and turn the house main disconnect back on.

Its not ideal, but it works - and the only expense was the heavy gauge cord/22v outlet and breaker.

Also - duracrete on 3500 S sells pre-cast cement pads for AC condenser units - I bought one of theirs to set my unit on - they are 2-3" thick. I assume they have other sizes.

 

[zmotorsports]

When I built my shop a few years ago I ran conduit under my concrete to where I want to put a standalone whole house (and shop) NG generator one day. I keep saving up for one but the money ends up going elsewhere instead. When we redid the main power meter we anticipated the transfer switch for both the house and shop and have the conduit stubbed up at the ground.

Following to see how this goes for you as I keep going back and forth on where this falls on my priority list.

Mike

 

[mbryson]

We were without power for about 4-5 days earlier this year. We just ran a basic generator to keep our two fridges running. That's gotten me thinking about keeping gasoline around and how to keep it fresh for the generator. It really doesn't have any other use to us other than in emergency situations. I think ours is a 3500 W unit? It didn't seem to care much about the hooked up refrigerators? Our perspective was just to keep the meat investment we have in our freezers still frozen. A couple day outage, you're likely ok. Longer than that, things could get interesting.

For our money, I think we'll stick to the lower end units rather than a whole house for $6k? I may want to figure out how to rig up the generator to the heater fan for heat in the winter? Our contractors did that while we were on temp power. I'm sure it can be done, I just need to figure out how to do it.

 

[lhracing]

I have done the poor mans power a couple of times using a Honda EU3000, that generator is too small but it is what I have. I need to get something larger but I will still do the temporary hook up when needed.

 

[Mouse]

I'm working to get more estimates. Pretty sure this first estimate will not get my business. When I said "north of $6K" it was almost double that...

Fortunately I have neighbor who used to install these and I was able to meet with him last night. He has a similar generator and the total install was $5500. He gave me a good contact to call, so I'm working that now.

 

[SLC97SR5]

My Dad had a 24kw Generac installed at his place this spring. He could get away with less but he wanted everything to work as normal with no thought to doing anything out of the ordinary. He might need to run both ovens, the AC and dry a load of laundry. I think that is how they sell such large units.

He used Jenco for the bid. https://www.jencogenerators.net/about-us/
It sounds like Master Electric is in the process of acquiring them.

His whole install was around 9k with pad, 2 transfer switches, gas and electrical permits.

During our outage in Davis County he and Mom were happy!

I've serviced the air cooled Generac's and they are super easy for routine maintenance but I've heard stories of proprietary components that are difficult to get a hold of.

 

[Kevin B.]

We were without power for about 4-5 days earlier this year. We just ran a basic generator to keep our two fridges running. That's gotten me thinking about keeping gasoline around and how to keep it fresh for the generator. It really doesn't have any other use to us other than in emergency situations. I think ours is a 3500 W unit? It didn't seem to care much about the hooked up refrigerators? Our perspective was just to keep the meat investment we have in our freezers still frozen. A couple day outage, you're likely ok. Longer than that, things could get interesting.

For our money, I think we'll stick to the lower end units rather than a whole house for $6k? I may want to figure out how to rig up the generator to the heater fan for heat in the winter? Our contractors did that while we were on temp power. I'm sure it can be done, I just need to figure out how to do it.

I need to pick up a little generator for exactly this reason. Just enough to keep the fridge and freezers happy and the cell phones charged.

 

[SLC97SR5]

I have the poor man's setup and it has worked great for us.
I have a 8k dual fuel (Gasoline and LPG) Champion that I also modded to run on NG. The NG and LPG drop the output but unless the house NG is disturbed we're OK.

This last outage had me wanting a smaller generator since the 8k is loud and drinks fuel...it has an 8 gallon tank and will run full tilt for 8 hours.

I purchased an A-Ipower Yamaha that is rated for 2300 surge and 1800 running. This is great for charging devices, keeping the Wi-Fi rolling and the fridge/freezer.

We have a 6 circuit transfer switch.

My next step is to buy an interlock piece of sheetmetal and install an inlet plug on our exterior main panel so the larger Gen can power the entire house. If my math is correct it'll run the AC. I just didn't want my wife to have to deal with wheeling out the big generator and using a bunch of fuel for maybe a 3.5Ah load.


I had to add the K&N sticker to unlock all the amps.

 

[Houndoc]

Interesting thread as I am thinking of adding one into my vet clinic when I do a next remodel in the coming years.

 

[Mouse]

A little more context for everyone. I retired from the Air Force in July. We moved to Utah in 2018. Prior to that we had a two-year assignment in Florida. During that time we were clobbered by 2 major hurricanes (Matthew and Irma). During those storms we lost power - no fun in the heat/humidity of FL. Since we knew we wouldn't retire there, we didn't invest in a whole house generator, but bought a smaller inverter style.

The small genny is good at keeping the frig and coffee maker working, but I get tired of dragging cords, refueling it and worrying about someone stealing it. So a whole house unit makes sense for us.

With the run on TP and other supplies early in 2020, there was also a run on backup generators. We were told that Generac shut down for 30 days in March, so that put supply behind even more. So, we expect to wait up to 6 months to get the generator. I want to get on contract soon so we have something whenever we can.

 

[Corban_White]

I may want to figure out how to rig up the generator to the heater fan for heat in the winter? Our contractors did that while we were on temp power. I'm sure it can be done, I just need to figure out how to do it.

Pretty easy to do. I could likely help you out with it the next time I'm in Davis county.

 

[Mouse]

Making progress. Under contract with Kendricks out of Smithfield. According to them, they are the state's Generac distributor. Their bid was about 12% lower than the first one. Have a 22KW unit on order and expect it to be installed in March.

Part of this contract I need to run a 20 ft gas line (plumber coming today) and make sure the gas meter can handle the increased flow. The generator needs a dedicated 300,000 BTU available. My house was set up originally for approximately 208,000 BTU. This required some homework with Dominion Energy. They told me that they could increase the pressure on our current meter to meet the load or upgrade to a larger flow unit and maintain the 4oz pressure. Since we plan to build a shop when construction prices come back to earth, I went the route of a larger meter. The quote for the meter alone was $1000, but Dominion is generous and will give us a $130 credit for the old meter. My generator rep tells me that this sounds about 2x the normal rate. Not sure I have much choice.

 

[Paul R]

Making progress. Under contract with Kendricks out of Smithfield. According to them, they are the state's Generac distributor.

For what it is worth, as far as I know there is no "the Generac distributor" for the state when it comes to residential. I don't know much about Kendrick Electric but I wouldn't be worried as long as you have done your due diligence and feel good about it and sounds like you have a price that works for you. There are more than 50 companies that can buy and sell Generac residential and smaller commercial units in Utah not counting the big box stores that often have pretty aggressive pricing.

Our company is the industrial dealer for the area and we specialize in the larger units(~30KW up through 2-3MW units). We don't often get involved with the residential sized units though we usually typically stock (out right now) a few units we won't usually do installs on them. Up through this last year we were also the trainer for the residential installers and distributors.

Generac is out quite a ways out on production so it is likely that many aren't giving the best deals right now because they are having to wait a long time for units and demand is sky high right now. March sounds about right for delivery. The 24KW is a brand new size and the next version of the 22KW which has been their best seller for some time. Generac owns the residential market and has a huge market share with far more resi units in the field than anyone else.

Sucks about the Dominion deal. Good luck with everything!

 

[Mouse]

Small update. Was able to determine another meter option. Upgrading to a 2 pound meter drops the price for the meter significantly, however it requires adding 2 regulators to the install (under $200 each). The main advantage of the 2 pound meter is that our max BTUs jump to 800,000 vs 600,000 (to support the shop later on). Overall the price will be similar.