How to use lockers properly

[plaidfro]

I have been searching around for some writeups or guides on proper locker use. I have really only found this write up that had any significant training content:

http://www.bb4wa.com/articles/Lockers.html

If you can find any other decent writeups or vids on proper locker use please post the links here. I am just trying to learn all I can.

Thanks

 

[Herzog]

Are there any specifics you are trying to learn? Are you wanting to know about locker types (selectable, lunchbox, spools, etc...) or how they function?

 

[Devel]

like when to use them?

 

[solidfrontaxle]

Just drive around, get in hairy situations, get stuck alot, and experiment. You'll figure it out, learn WAY mare in the process, and its way more fun than reading an article. Thats my 2 cents.

Just don't try to back up with the wheels cranked. Thats when NOT to use them....

 

[iamsparticus]

Petersens 4wheel mag had a article awhile back on using lockers im to lazy to go look it up though

 

[iamsparticus]

http://www.4wheeloffroad.com/techarticles/truck_locker_basics/index.html
not as good as i remember

 

[sixstringsteve]

Cool, good for you for leaning as much as you can.

I would focus on learning how lockers work and what they're actually doing inside your diff. Learn what happens when you do a u-turn. Envision each wheel turning and find out how the locker would behave. Also learn about the stress that they can put on your drivetrain in the wrong situations.

It's probably going to be easier to search when NOT to use a locker, vs when to use a locker.

Some people try to fun an entire trail without their lockers, and they only engage them when they start struggling. Others keep 'em on all the time. Most people can't turn 'em on or off, so they're always driving with an "automatic" locker.

If you don't have a locker yet, see if you can drive someone's rig with a locker. That'll give you a good feel of what they feel like.

It's good to read up on how different types of lockers work and what they do.

As you know, actually using one vs reading about one is going to teach you the most. But in the mean time, I would focus on learning how the lockers work.

It's also going to be easier to

 

[plaidfro]

I understand the mechanics of lockers, what they are, what they do... and I understand the different types of lockers. I am looking for more practical application when off-roading. Specifically I am looking for advice on when to turn them on, when to turn them off, when to use only front or only rear or both? What are the absolute no no's if you want your locker to live a long life?

That write up I listed in the first post is a good start as he does answer some of the above listed questions and also provides answers for failure to heed the advice. I usually like to validate advice from several sources so that it why I was looking for additional guides for appropriate locker use

 

[sixstringsteve]

Hm... I don't know of a resource for that other than experience.

When rockcrawling, I leave mine on all the time, except for some side-hills, snowy descents, or where there is a ton of traction already (hell's revenge).

I know it's a generic answer, and not what you're looking for, but each vehicle is really going to behave differently with, or without a locker. Kinda like saying "when should you wear a seatbelt in a car?" Because some accidents a seatbelt saves your life, and in some accidents, you're saved because you didn't have a seatbelt on. I always wear my seatbelt though.

I'd say too much HP, and too much binding are bad for lockers and axles. If you're pulling up to an undercut ledge, a locker could lead to an axle shaft failure sooner than an open diff. Spools, elockers (spools), and air lockers (spools) will try to push you straight when you turn. Not a huge deal if you're rockcrawling at 1 MPH, but if you're flying up the canyon on a snowy day, it'll matter. I know this isn't what you're looking for, but hopefully it helps.

 

[utah340six]

its like when were kids we would go out fishen or hunting in 2 wheel drive till we got stuck.
put the chains on and put in 4 wheel drive and go home.

lockes i put mine on just when im going to do some thing i cant do in 4 wheel drive.
first the rear locker then the front locker.
get trough obsticle and then unlock them.
less wear and tear on axels.

 

[Slangy]

I understand the mechanics of lockers, what they are, what they do... and I understand the different types of lockers. I am looking for more practical application when off-roading. Specifically I am looking for advice on when to turn them on, when to turn them off, when to use only front or only rear or both? What are the absolute no no's if you want your locker to live a long life?

That write up I listed in the first post is a good start as he does answer some of the above listed questions and also provides answers for failure to heed the advice. I usually like to validate advice from several sources so that it why I was looking for additional guides for appropriate locker use

I have a detroit in the rear of my TJ, so it is always locked. I also have an ARB in the front, I turn my ARB on and off as I need it, makes maneuvering a hell of a lot easier when it is off. When I get to a obstacle, if it's not to crazy I will try it without the ARB engaged, if I can't get past it I hit the switch and off we go (most of the time). Before I had the ARB I had a TruTrac up front, I must say it did not work for what I was wanting.

Like everyone else has said, research and decide the type of locker you want, then go out and test it out, you will learn when to use the locker and when not to, that is if you went with a selectable locker. Most of all just get out and enjoy it.

 

[Jinx]

What kind of vehicle? because vehicle and use determine everything.

I run detroits front and rear in a couple of vehicles but I also have hubs so that changes things compared to some newer vehicles...

 

[plaidfro]

I have a 94' Jeep Wrangler SOA on 35" tires, that have ARB Lockers front and rear. So for me its learning how to correctly use these things and minimize any potential damage I could cause to the axles and diff.

The rear axle is a D44 out of a Scout II regeared to 4.56 so it is a much better axle than the stock D35, although it would be nice to have something stronger in the future.

The front axle is the stock D30 regeared to 4.56. I would love a D44 here but I will with this thing till it does eventually die. This axle is my biggest concern about proper locker use... I don't want to use the lockers wrong and cause undue stress to the shafts.

I don't plan on driving with the hammer down and bouncing and chirping the tires. I am hoping to be able to learn to drive off-road with slow, smooth control successfully going through obstacles without getting the testosterone up thinking I need to pick more extreme lines.

I do appreciate how many of you are willing to chime in and share your two cents. I think I have the right mentality going about this, its just nice to validate some of my thoughts and approaches to off-roading with your responses.

 

[dentedvw]

I might have read somewhere that the rear locker on a TJ Rubicon was both a limited slip, and a full locking differential, when you turn it on. Same place someone recommended to run with the rear locker on when on a moderately difficult trail, because the rear locker will withstand more abuse than the limited slip part. Also said that the rear is a clutch pack style, and the front is geared, so the front was stronger.

Does that sound right? I am all new to locking differentials too. So far, in my wheeling with it, I have left them off, unless I couldn't make it up something, or knew I wouldn't, then turned it/them off when I was beyond the obstacle. This is only since November though, so it's not a lot of experience. I wheeled a long time open front and rear, and learned a lot, but it's been a long time between 4x4 vehicles.

 

[Jinx]

I have a 94' Jeep Wrangler SOA on 35" tires, that have ARB Lockers front and rear. So for me its learning how to correctly use these things and minimize any potential damage I could cause to the axles and diff.

you are not in a bad spot with your set up. It seems like '93-'94 is when the dana 30s went to the bigger u joint and driven reasonably should last you a long time with 35" tires.

Now back to the locker talk. Personally I don't like ARBs because there are too many parts to fail and leave you stranded. BUT that is just personal opinion. A lot of guys, Kurt, Team Fred, etc love their ARBs.

I would suggest as a general rule, if you are on the street/pavement, leave your diffs open, or do not use your lockers. There isn't a need. Your jeep will drive better, steer better, you will like it better.

Next: mild trails, I would probably just engaged your rear axle. Added traction will keep the need for extra momentum low, while keeping steering more friendly.

Next: Obstacles, if you can't make an obstacle with just your rear, try your front before you try rallying it. Most times the added traction will keep things pulling vs spinning.

Note: For the most part tire spin is bad. Especially bouncing or sudden traction. That is where things break big; Axle shafts, u joints, drive lines, t case gears or yokes.

Lockers are your friends but keep in mind to use them for a purpose and you will be fine. A stock rig without lockers/traction will likely spinout before you get where you shouldn't be. A rig with lockers/traction, will likely go where you point it, even if it is a bad idea, and hence a better chance of rolling, etc.

good luck

 

[mbryson]

I might have read somewhere that the rear locker on a TJ Rubicon was both a limited slip, and a full locking differential, when you turn it on. Same place someone recommended to run with the rear locker on when on a moderately difficult trail, because the rear locker will withstand more abuse than the limited slip part. Also said that the rear is a clutch pack style, and the front is geared, so the front was stronger.

Does that sound right? I am all new to locking differentials too. So far, in my wheeling with it, I have left them off, unless I couldn't make it up something, or knew I wouldn't, then turned it/them off when I was beyond the obstacle. This is only since November though, so it's not a lot of experience. I wheeled a long time open front and rear, and learned a lot, but it's been a long time between 4x4 vehicles.

I'm fairly confident it's NOT A LIMITED SLIP. I don't see Jeep sourcing two different lockers for a fairly limited production vehicle.

I have a 94' Jeep Wrangler SOA on 35" tires, that have ARB Lockers front and rear. So for me its learning how to correctly use these things and minimize any potential damage I could cause to the axles and diff.

The rear axle is a D44 out of a Scout II regeared to 4.56 so it is a much better axle than the stock D35, although it would be nice to have something stronger in the future.

The front axle is the stock D30 regeared to 4.56. I would love a D44 here but I will with this thing till it does eventually die. This axle is my biggest concern about proper locker use... I don't want to use the lockers wrong and cause undue stress to the shafts.

I don't plan on driving with the hammer down and bouncing and chirping the tires. I am hoping to be able to learn to drive off-road with slow, smooth control successfully going through obstacles without getting the testosterone up thinking I need to pick more extreme lines.

I do appreciate how many of you are willing to chime in and share your two cents. I think I have the right mentality going about this, its just nice to validate some of my thoughts and approaches to off-roading with your responses.

I had ARB lockers in my XJ. D30 and D44. I'd pretty much run trails unlocked unless you thought you needed something. I'd then lock the rear and try the obstacle. If that didn't work, I'd lock the front and try it again. There were occasions I used the front without the rear locked, but I can't remember where at the moment. I think you're in a good spot with your current setup and I think I'd leave it how it is and stick with 35" tires. If you haven't, I'd get the TJ shafts in your D30 (assuming it's a normal disconnect type YJ axle) and get the bigger axle joints.

For a LONG time, I ran a D30 and D35. D30 was ARB and the D35 had the factory "track lock". I got around pretty good with up to 33" tires with that setup. The D35 legends (and experiences of other people on the trail) convinced me to move to the XJ D44 when I went to 35" tires. For my use and style of driving with the 33" and under tires, the D35 served me well (much better than most people).

In my current rig, I have an e-locker in the front and have run a spool in the rear. The spool really does get old, but the only "wear" parts are the cross pins in the spool and the splines on the shafts. I have just switched to a Detroit and it's MUCH more civilized now. I still drive the same way as I did before with the front locker engaged, vs. not. There are things I KNOW I'll need the front locked, though and just turn it on.

 

[plaidfro]

I would suggest as a general rule, if you are on the street/pavement, leave your diffs open, or do not use your lockers. There isn't a need. Your jeep will drive better, steer better, you will like it better.

Next: mild trails, I would probably just engaged your rear axle. Added traction will keep the need for extra momentum low, while keeping steering more friendly.

Next: Obstacles, if you can't make an obstacle with just your rear, try your front before you try rallying it. Most times the added traction will keep things pulling vs spinning.

Note: For the most part tire spin is bad. Especially bouncing or sudden traction. That is where things break big; Axle shafts, u joints, drive lines, t case gears or yokes.

Lockers are your friends but keep in mind to use them for a purpose and you will be fine. A stock rig without lockers/traction will likely spinout before you get where you shouldn't be. A rig with lockers/traction, will likely go where you point it, even if it is a bad idea, and hence a better chance of rolling, etc.

This type of advice is what I have been reading, and goes along with my thought process on lockers. I never planned on using them on pavement or on a snowy road. Maybe only to help get it moving if stuck in a snow bank or some really deep snow. As for the off-road I never use them unless faced with an trail obstacle. I would always drop the rear in and only put on the front if the obstacle was a bit challenging looking (from my perspective). Tyson was nice enough to let me know he didnt use his front locker or 4lo when I followed him out of Rattlesnake a few weeks ago. I pretty much ran the whole thing in 4lo and had front and rear locked in when approaching each obstacle. So I am sure I will learn the 'feel' when I need to have lockers in or out. It does seem like experience will be the best teacher.

A local guy here gave me some advice to "be aware that using lockers will now help you get into an area that you may not be able to get yourself out of."

 

[DAA]

I might have read somewhere that the rear locker on a TJ Rubicon was both a limited slip, and a full locking differential, when you turn it on. Same place someone recommended to run with the rear locker on when on a moderately difficult trail, because the rear locker will withstand more abuse than the limited slip part. Also said that the rear is a clutch pack style, and the front is geared, so the front was stronger.

Does that sound right?

Close. The TJ Rubicon rear end is a limited slip when not locked, but it's a gear driven, "Torsen" type LSD, not a clutch pack style. The front on a TJ Rubi is open when not locked.

I've heard both ways for the TJ Rubi rear being less prone to break while locked vs. unlocked. I don't know which way is less likely to break. I do know, that I have personally seen two TJ Rubi rear lockers break, but haven't yet seen the diff itself break. But, the small sample size I've seen, might not mean anything. Because while I've not yet seen it myself, I have heard about plenty of these rear LSD's breaking. It's a relatively weak two pinion design. I have read aobut some guys after having the rear LSD break, replaced them with the same diff as the front, because there is less chance for breakage on the open unit.

- DAA

 

[JL Rockies]

When you feel the need to lock ask yourself, "did a certain turbo diesel KJ make it through here with open diffs?"

 

[plaidfro]

When you feel the need to lock ask yourself, "did a certain turbo diesel KJ make it through here with open diffs?"

Did you? Stock Axles too?

A bit off topic, I think I would really love to have a YJ or a TJ with the CRD engine. I am a huge sucker for a turbo diesel engine... I love those things.