my cummins quit won't start help please!!!

[mesha]

So now that I bought a new rig I guess it is time to replace everything.
2004.5 cummins. I was driving to dinner a couple of hours ago. we had 1/8 of a tank according to the gauge. the overhead computer thing said 84 miles till empty. I was running great ad then it got really low on power and wouldn't go. we pulled over andit died. cranked it and it won't start back up. I thought maybe it was out of fuel so I put 2 gallons more in it and cranked and it sarted ran for about 4 seconds and then died. this happened a few more times. It won't start at all any more. I tried cracking the nut thing on the injector rail and nothing comes out when I crank. I don't know what to do to get it running again. do I have to purge the system of air or should I look for something else. thanks in advance.

 

[cruiseroutfit]

Lift pump?

 

[Bodine]

Can you hear the pump when you turn the key without cranking it over?

 

[Rot Box]

If you can get it started a cp3 injector pump should pull fuel from the tank and run at an idle or with slight throttle without a working lift pump.

I wouldn't stress too much. If your injector pump failed it will throw an engine code/check engine light.

Next in line would be your lift pump. Sometimes you can hear the lift pump 'pump' if you turn the key to the acc position, but that is not always the case. Typically you have to build oil pressure (engine running) for the lift pump to activate...

The Piezo injectors can (and have been known to) prematurely fail but its doubtfull that a few all went at once and your engine will run on a failed injector.

My guess is you are air locked. Pull off the fuel filter and fill it with clean fuel and proceed to purge to system the way the service manual recommends. Not sure about the common rail trucks but I find that if you purge the system and crack open an injector line directly above the injector the system will purge quite well. Try this and see what happens.

 

[jdub]

Apples and Oranges but My (gas) fuel pump would sound but it wasn't doing the job. I replaced everything else. I ran the pump hardwired in my hand and it pumped but couldn't build up enough pressure to do the job.

I feel for you. Start with the small stuff and good luck.

 

[pELYgroso]

sorry to hear that man! Do you at least still have the Chev until you get it sorted out?

 

[bryson]

I'll bet it ran out of fuel (sucked air) and just needs to be bled better... They are a pain in the a$$ to get all the air out of. It can take several minutes of cracking the bleeder and cycling the pump... do you have fuel in the fuel filter housing?

 

[mesha]

I will try repurging the system. I didn't try getting the fuel filter off last night I will go get working on that and see what happens. I sold my chevy literally a hour before this happened. I had to get someone to help pull me home(thanks jsudar).

 

[Greg]

Welcome to Dodge diesel ownership.... I'd be willing to bet your gauge is off and you ran out of fuel. When the lift pump died in our '03 (all 3 times ) the truck would still run.

My '98 ran out of fuel after the gauge started reading 1/4 tank high within a couple days. This happened outside of Winnemucca, NV and I had to get it towed to the local Dodge dealership to have the system re-primed.

 

[mesha]

Dealership guy told me a shouldn't have to purge it. He thinks it is a lift pump and says about 1000 bucks. suck

 

[Greg]

Dealership guy told me a shouldn't have to purge it. He thinks it is a lift pump and says about 1000 bucks. suck

That does suck, I know my '03 had the lift pump on the frame. It was an easy job to change it, took about 30 min. It's just a feed pump between the tank and the injection pump. There's no reason you couldn't do it yourself. I would verify that it's on the frame though, I know at some point the newer Dodges put the lift pump in the tank, making this a much harder job.

Time to install a fuel pressure gauge so you can monitor what your lift pump is doing. Sometimes if your lift pump goes out, it can burn up your injection pump. The IP runs around $2,200-2,500... on top of the lift pump.

 

[bryson]

Dealership guy told me a shouldn't have to purge it. He thinks it is a lift pump and says about 1000 bucks. suck

Dealer guy is full of it IMO...

If he says you don't have to purge the system, does he intend on you cranking the starter long enough to work all the air out? That's one hot starter! Have you verified that the lift pump is working? Are you getting good pressure at the rail when you try to bleed it? I have heard though that the CP3 pumps (your injection pump) usually won't burn up if it's starved for fuel... which is a good thing.

Oh, and don't let Greg's banter bother you... he's just bitter. And had REALLY bad luck with his last truck.

 

[smashmetal]

I take it this truck is new to you? Do you know if the truck has had the intank boost pump put in it?
03-04 truck had a big problem with boost pumps going out. The ones that had the problem (like mine) ended up having the dealer ship install an intank pump.
There for Dodge ended up switching to intank boost pumps in 2005.

Your simptums sound just like mine when my boost pump went out, truck would die. Let it sit a while and it would fire back up only to die again.

 

[smashmetal]

Dealer guy is full of it IMO...

If he says you don't have to purge the system, does he intend on you cranking the starter long enough to work all the air out? That's one hot starter! Have you verified that the lift pump is working? Are you getting good pressure at the rail when you try to bleed it? I have heard though that the CP3 pumps (your injection pump) usually won't burn up if it's starved for fuel... which is a good thing.

Oh, and don't let Greg's banter bother you... he's just bitter. And had REALLY bad luck with his last truck.

I have never had to bleed my fuel system during a fuel filter change in my 04. I drain the bowl to make sure there is not sediment in the bottom. Put in the new filter, throw the cap on (with out adding fuel to the bowl)and just cycle the key a few times to refill the bowl. Fires up every time

 

[Rot Box]

1000 bucks?! Wow

You could install a FASS or AIRDOG for much less than that and have the ultimate in fuel pump upgrades. All a lift pump does is supply the injector pump with a regulated amount of fuel. I would NEVER pay that much for a lift pump of any sort. If the dealer is right and it is the lift/fuel pump it is a very easy fix I would highly recommend preforming the work and buying the parts yourself as you will save hundreds of dollars...

 

[tv_larsen]

Start with the easy things, try a NEW fuel filter.

 

[Herzog]

I'll second that the dealer is full of crap. Try repriming yourself. If it's similar to my '01 (I know they are different pumps) you just need to bump the key and let the pump run... then bump again.

If you can't get it to prime, then I'd say you have a bad lift pump. I assume the '04's are in the tank which is a pain but it shouldn't cost you more than $200 to diy.

 

[LT.]

Mesha, I am sorry I did not see this earlier so here are some things to look at. I think I saw you had said you were getting white smoke out of the tail pipe. This is a sure fire way to say you are not getting the fuel.

First, you need to make sure there is fuel to be had. You will need more fuel in the tank. Second, check to make sure you are getting a supply from the tank. If all is good then check your fuel filter. These modern Diesels should have the fuel filter changed every 12,000 miles. If you have fuel there then you need to check for fuel in the engine compartment. Running any Diesel out of fuel can be very costly. Most of the fuel pumps use the Diesel fuel as a luberciant. Without fuel the pumps are running with out any lubes and will wear very quickly or quit working due to excessive heat. In tank fuel pumps, as you have already discovered, will cost $1,000 very easily. CP-3 pumps are more expensive. Your dealer was feeding you a line of BS. You will have to bleed the fuel lines or you will run the risk of burning up the pumps, if you were lucky and just ran out of fuel. Or you will burn up the starter. Either way you will cause damage to the truck.

I hope this helps.

LT.

 

[mesha]

I didn't notice any smoke coming out of the tail pipe. I put an additional 2 gallons in but can put more in.

 

[LT.]

I didn't notice any smoke coming out of the tail pipe. I put an additional 2 gallons in but can put more in.

Sorry. I must have been thinking about another post in regards to the smoke. Everything else I wrote earlier still holds true in my experience. Check the easy things first.

LT.