Which new axle shafts? (9")

[jeepin4x4james]

I've got a Sunray 9" in the rear of my LJ... last year I broke the ring gear at Sand Hollow, this year I broke a shaft (on the exact same obstacle)... I'm looking to upgrade the shafts. Currently it has Moser 35 spline and a Detroit. Looking at going to a spool, possibly to 40 spline.

This kit from Mark Williams includes 40 spline shafts, bearings, retainers, spool for $1016.... The shafts are through-hardened, should be super strong and hopefully the last shafts I buy. Of course this leaves my 3rd as the weak point, perhaps I can upgrade to a GW 10" or Mega 9 in the distant future.

Moser has a similar kit for $705... Not sure on axle material, hardening, or spline strength compared to the MW kit.

Or I can stick with 35 spline and run this kit from Strange. Includes shafts, spool, bearings, etc... only $594. Should be nice and strong... made from 'hy-tuf'


This is a semi float axle, so not sure if any of the above axle material will be too hard and cause issues due to lateral stresses, going full-float would be a cool option too, but appears I would have to spend a minimum of $2k going that route, in which case I would have to consider just going to a 14-bolt instead.

All suggestions would be much appreciated.

(Rig info: 40" stickies, LT1, occasional heavy foot )

 

[Gravy]

What third do you have now?

 

[Another Jeep]

Avoid the Superior brand shafts! I had bad, bad luck with those in my 9"

 

[jeepin4x4james]

What third do you have now?

Nodular iron, unsure of brand, stock pinion support ( I know I should upgrade to Daytona)
I've looked at getting a through-bolt third with the 10-bolt pinion support....

 

[jeepin4x4james]

Avoid the Superior brand shafts! I had bad, bad luck with those in my 9"

Good to know.... A write-up on Pirate basically said Superior shafts were the only way to go, but after reading the whole thing it did seem a bit biased. Perhaps the writer received some free shafts for his contribution

 

[Gravy]

My bet is the broken r/p shockloaded and weakened the shaft.
The real question is where did you break your R/P? because that will tell you pretty quickly if you need a bigger gear set.

If you stripped teeth: a 3rd that has a load bolt, a daytona style pinion support, Yukon spool and Yukon 4340 35 spline shafts.

If you twisted a pinion: a 35 spline pinion gear, a daytona style pinion support, Yukon spool and Yukon 4340 35 spline shafts.
I've twisted a 35 spline Yukon shaft at the splines just outside the spool but I was getting pretty rowdy.

It seems like the consensus is that the weak point will always be the R/P (on a 9") with 40spline shafts.
and 10" R/P are NOT cheap.


The cheap option: 14bolt.
Having seen both break: My Opinion is that a hardened 35 spline shaft is much stronger than stock a 14 bolt shaft.
In which case you'll be putting fancy shafts into a 14 bolt anyways.

So, either a better 3rd with better r/p and shafts
or
a 14 bolt with shafts
IF you don't want to break in the same place.
or back it off a bit in Sand Hollow lol

Sorry if that was convoluted, but a pro con sheet with costs always seems to convince me which way to go.

I'm sure Carl could chime in. He's probably broken more 9" stuff than anyone.

 

[UFAB]

Step up to full float.

We can cut your outer semi float bearing pockets off and weld on some full float unit bearing setups with any wheel bolt pattern with 13.8" rotors.

Also weighs less than any spindle old school type.

 

[RockChucker]

I echo what UFAB says. A full float set up will be stronger, even if you stay with a 35 spline shaft. A full float shaft only has to transmit torsional load rather than both transmit torque and support the weight of the vehicle. I have heard of guys doing it a really cheap way and using 14 bolt spindles and hubs too if unit bearings aren't your cup of tea.

 

[jeepin4x4james]

The break last time was stripped ring gear, I have no doubt that that contributed to the shaft break this time.
It was on the gatekeeper to Double Sammy.

Cost looks like I'll be about $1200 for a full float kit, and $600 more for shafts. Total of $1800 not including upgrading the 3rd.

Seems I could get a 14-bolt for around $200, gears, spool, shafts for another $1200.... But then it won't match my front axle (9") that is 63" WMS and 5x5.5
Less expensive though at $1400 and should be stronger....

Hard to decide, just want the best bang for my buck

 

[jeepin4x4james]

Step up to full float.

We can cut your outer semi float bearing pockets off and weld on some full float unit bearing setups with any wheel bolt pattern with 13.8" rotors.

Also weighs less than any spindle old school type.

UFAB, could you PM me a quote for parts/labor to go over to full float?

I think I just want to stick with this axle, maybe a bit more $$ but less work than going to a 14-bolt, plus I won't have to worry about changing the front.

 

[RockChucker]

A cab and chassis 14 bolt is about 63" wms.

 

[neagtea]

What ratio are you running?
I would think about ufab full floating yours, buy a r&p and Daytona support and run it with a decent set of shafts.
Just 2 cents

 

[flexyfool]

If you keep the 9", have the builder install a truss and check the straightness with an alignment bar. I saw you break last year in the Maze.

 

[jeepin4x4james]

5.13's.... Eventually would like to change to 5.38-5.40

Not sure who makes to best gears.... Last years break was Richmond gears, replaced those with Yukons (gear set-up made me disappointed in Yukon..)
The broken shaft is a Moser chromo....

I think I'll get a Daytona support, replace the shafts with 35-spline, not sure on brand.... Then sell it as a complete bolt-in for a TJ.
There's a guy on pirate that has a Rockcrusher 60 with Jana 76 conversion, load bolt, etc for a decent price, WMS of 64" so close enough, and full float so I can just swap the 8 lug hubs for 5 so I don't have to buy new wheels. And it matches my front 5.13 ratio....

 

[flexyfool]

5 on 5.5" may be the smallest full float hub you can get to match the 60.

 

[neagtea]

Here is a couple comparisons
One is a 9" ring next to a 9.5"
One is a 9" with Daytona support next to a 9.5" with GW support, the 9.5" is 35 spline pinion.
The last one is a 60 standard rotate next to the 9.5", all are 4.56 ratio
Enjoy

 

[jeepin4x4james]

Still can't make up my mind... would like to just get it done right and not have to worry about it.
So here's my options:

Change to D60 & 14-bolt Total Cost: $400 (after selling current setup)
Stock axles: $1200
Gears, spool, Grizzly, Shafts, joints, install kits: $3500
Mount tabs, brackets, etc: $500
New beadlocks: $2000
---Sell current axles, wheels (2 sets) and hopefully come out with $6800
Pro's:
Should be strong enough to not worry about on 40-42" tires
Abundant after market support
Abundant junk yard & parts store support
Change ratio (5.40 instead of 5.13)
Bit wider (I'm at 63", wouldn't mind 67")
Con's:
More time/work to get in
Big, Heavy axles
I already have 2 full sets of beadlocks, would have to start over on wheels...
Lot of $$ up front until current setup sells..
Couldn't wheel for a while during swap

Build current setup stronger Total cost: $2825
Convert rear axle to full-float: $1800 (includes unit bearings, shafts, etc)
New 3rd with load bolt: $700
Install kit: $125
Daytona support + bearings: $200
Pro's:
Don't have to mess with the front axle that I've never had issues with (don't think I ever will)
Don't have to fab up all new mounts for new axles
Small profile light-weight axles
Different than every other rig on 'tons'
Get to keep my current wheels
Con's:
Will it be strong enough?
More expensive in the long run, could be lots more expensive if it still breaks
Not as wide as I'd like it

Thought's?
All comments would be much appreciated. Anyone with first hand experience? ... Utra4 rigs seem to run the 9 (or 10) a lot... but then again they are usually the super expensive Mega9 or GW10 3rd...

Are there better options I'm missing?

Current axles: Sunray Engineering built 9" front and rear. Fabricated housings, Moser nodular iron 3rds, Moser 35 spline shafts, 1550 front joints.....

 

[RockChucker]

Dana 30 and 35. Super light weight, and if you don't hit speed bumps too fast, they won't bend :greg:

seriously though, I don't think you can go wrong either way. my axles are full width, with the front at 69" and the rear at 67". I love it. I'm running H2 wheels with 5.5" of back spacing, and I'll tell ya what, it handles better on 60's than it did with my 30 and the very shallow back spaced wheels I was running. If you do decide to go the 60 route, I have an 86 ford king pin housing with shafts and 4.10's installed that I'd like $600 out of. You would need, knuckles, spindles, and brake parts. Pretty easy to source, and an excellent time to upgrade to Chevy stuff over the ford, since Ford knuckles are notoriously weak

 

[gertsch]

Y not a Torq axle?

 

[jeepin4x4james]

Y not a Torq axle?

Hmmm... Hadn't actually thought of that. And I just found that Solid makes 5x5.5 hubs for the 14 bolt